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B230+T5 3k rpm shake

Stiggy Pop said:
At one point I had an aftermarket (MTC?) shift boot on my car that was really thick and stiff compared with OE, it was stiff enough it was actually pulling the t5 out of fifth. Tried running no boot already?

I'm just super picky on ratios. Part of the reason is because of how much I built my car for top end power, so to me the right gear spacing to stay in the power is the difference between the car being fun and quick or totally useless around here.
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I need to do that - I'm using the stock rubber 240 boot on it now. And the shifter is on an offset, so it moves up and down with the shifter throw, so in 5th it is pulling the lever down some.

And the current setup is just a sort of placeholder until I get around to putting on the narrowed Ford 8.8 I have sitting in the garage. I just wanted to get the car up and driving around before finishing up the last few things on it.

The CD009 just has some weird ratios.
1 - 3.784
2 - 2.324
3 - 1.624
4 - 1.271
5 - 1.000
6 - 0.794

Certainly not made to work well with a 3.73 rear end. Although apparently, in the Nissans they use them with a 3.5(ish) rear end - so they're spinning the motors pretty fast most of the time.
 
JohnMc said:
Mine (regular garden variety V8 5.0 Mustang T5) was OK with the 1 pc driveshaft. A little noisy, but not bad.

Then after shredding and ovalizing the torque rod bushings, I stuck some IPD adjustables on with poly bushings. And picked up some really bad vibrations. Mostly power on, mostly around (roughly) 3000 rpm. Like shaking the whole car. Not like something was out of balance, just BBBBRRRNRRREZZRZRZZRZR FUuuuuuuU!U!!!

I assumed I'd screwed up the u-joint angles and spent a month or two trying to 'fix' it. Rear of the trans up/down/in between. Careful measurement of the u-joint angles front and rear, setting the torque rod lengths to get that spot on. None of it seemed to make any difference. Thn out of frustration I set the adjustable torque rods full short. Really bad u-joint angles (in theory). No change. Set them about as long as safe. No change.

Then I got a set of crusty rusty old stock torque rods from a junkyard 240 and bolted them on. No vibration.

Dunno, I'm just assuming the B230 made vibrations, the T5 modified/amplified them, and the rear axle acted like a speaker for them when mounted using poly bushings? I certainly didn't fix any issue that would *cause* vibration by replacing snug poly bushings with slightly wiggly stock rubber, but it apparently changed the harmonics of the drivetrain as a whole.

After the LS swap, I was hearing some clunks from under there. Yep, shredded bushings and ovalized housings again. I threw the IPD arms back on and no real vibrations. Other than a sort of weird no-torque vibration at speeds 'well north' of 100 I've noticed. Smooth under power, smooth on engine braking, but at a 'neutral' throttle setting, vibration. not very comforting feeling, makes me think of Jared's new parts car with the broken driveshaft.
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So this is interesting, I'm running the ipd poly arms also. Maybe I'll cut up a stock set to length and see what that does. I'm also on Ben's spherical bearings in the bottom of the axle.

I should add I'm on stock trans mount, and this isn't in the dash, its trans/shifter in that area. Engine mounts are the yoshifab ones everyone thought were too stiff (land rover?) but at idle and everywhere else it's great. Decel rattle is a whole different beast. I've got that in 4th gear in 2 cars and it is what it is, I've learned to ignore it.

The car is getting a new water pump right now, and I stole the slip yoke off of it for my 122. I'll get that stuff sorted and update with some more specifics when I can.
 
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Stiggy Pop said:
I love mine, it's not the transmissions fault that I put it behind a vibey four-cylinder then dropped it into a 1970's ****box :lol:

it's that or follow the trend and spend a bunch of money on a cd009 swap with terrible gear ratios :)
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I will admit I raced a 244 Turbo with a new Tremec(?) T5 this year at Palmer and that was a damn fine gearbox. For a street or even DD car, though, I'd do an M90.
 
3 month bump

Swapped in a V6 slip yoke and a stock harmonic balancer in place of the KL Racing underdrive pulley (look for the Australian made Dayco, it's shockingly nice) last night at Culberro's shop (thank u :love: ). Vibration shifted from 2500 to 2100 with a drastically decreased magnitude (~80%). In 3rd-5th gears the shake is now a distant rumble, thus making the car infinitely more livable.

Trans likely still needs the counter shaft preload re-set, but this is definitely a step in the right direction.
 
Does it shake with the clutch pedal down in gear? (car stopped)
This would isolate the problem to the motor (likely flywheel or pressure plate) as the clutch disc and trans would not be spinning.

In neutral will include the trans (and clutch disc) but not the driveline.

Driveline shake will change with vehicle speed no matter what gear it is in, it will shake in neutral coasting.
 
It's completely speed independent. Motor resonates a tiny amount in neutral, either with the pressure plate engaged or not. Piston+rod assemblies are all within .2g. I did not have the crank polished or rebalanced but they all seem to be pretty much dead on; last motor had these same pistons and rods with the crank polished and balanced and vibrations were the same. Clutch has been rebalanced independently. Driveshaft was rebuilt (balance, straighten, new heavy duty carrier+bearing, new u joints) at Driveline Services.

These motors resonate, and there is no practical way to cancel out the inevitable second order harmonics. The OEM solution is a big giant tuned mass damper bonded to the slip yoke on 4 cylinder T-5 applications.

The shake we are referring to is the engine's natural resonance that gets amplified by the transmission, which I suspect has a natural frequency that is very close to a redblock's resonance at 2500ish RPM.
 
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I chased the shifter buzz and gear clatter on mine for a while. Even tried going to the t5z style mainshaft with the tapered roller bearing and more preload wondering if it would quiet the gears. Nope.

What I did manage was to get the shift buzz under control. On the highway the sound and vibration was unbearable. In the end I just had to spend an afternoon under the car getting the driveline angles dead on. Massive difference. Can cruise on the highway again, and I don't cringe taking it into boost and revving it up to where it used to buzz the shifter like crazy.
 
That V6 yoke with the balancer made a big difference on the 140 as well, dropping the severity and rpm range of the gear rattle. I've got one more thing to try on mine, including swapping to a different T5 I've got, see if it helps. There's a machined retainer available for the countershaft, Ryan has one in his, that may keep that countershaft more solidly located. I have an untouched T5 on the bench to play with so I'll see if it goes in quiet, along with that V6 balancer.

I've also thought about taking a couple ounces of tire weights to put some weight on the driveline as well, see if that changes things.
 
Harlard said:
The shake we are referring to is the engine's natural resonance that gets amplified by the transmission, which I suspect has a natural frequency that is very close to a redblock's resonance at 2500ish RPM.
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Wow I though this was just me. Yes I get a weird resonance at about 2600 to 3100 RPM. I ran my engine without the trans attached to see if this was caused by the tans but it seems the trans only amplifies it. The resonance is still there albeit not nearly as noticeable.


I may decide to re shim the counter shaft and replace the retainer with one of Paul’s beefier ones.
I recently watched one of his tare down videos where he torn down a new unit and the counter shaft preload was too loose.

In addition I just checked my main shaft shim with the dee works bearing retainer and have found it was preloaded too high about 9 thou. Hopefully I didn’t crush that flat roller bearing between the input and main shaft. (my fault nothing to do with the adapter)

Also I found that my T5 occasionally slides out of 5th gear after about a half dozen accel / decel cycles in 5th. I am hoping this is due to the accel / decel vibration but I am curious if anyone else has encountered this. According to tremec trouble shooting guide this could be as a result of poor bell housing alignment but I have checked that to be less the 2 thou. The speed that this seems to occur is about 75 mph which would put me at about 2500 rpm range with a 3.73 rear end and a 0.68 5th. Hmm.
 
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Sounds like I need to find a V6 yoke then. My car is back running again, and still has that resonance, though mine is probably 2800-3100 on decel in any gear. Basically stock B230f with the stock balancer. 5th sounds like a gravel grinder but it needs a new gear/syncro set anyways. If I could get rid of that ****ty resonance I'd be a happy camper.
 
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After re shimming the counter shaft to have about 4in lbs of drag torque and setting main shaft lash to a solid 2 thou preload with the v6 slip yoke there is. . . .
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......... no discernible difference.

Buzzes when I roll into boost, buzzes on decel, its only tolerable when cruising when there is little load on the system.

Big ass slip yoke damper here I come.
 
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