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Old 09-07-2020, 08:12 AM   #1
VolvoGLT
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Default Classicswede 27/27mm sway bars

Has anyone put Classic Swede's 27mm front and rear bars on his Volvo? If yes, how does the car handle? 27mm rear (although hollow) is quite a big bar...


https://www.classicswede.co.uk/Anti_..._18798591.aspx
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Old 09-07-2020, 01:46 PM   #2
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Depending on wall thickness, these could actually be softer than the IPD bars but save some weight.
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Old 09-07-2020, 08:19 PM   #3
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I would never put a bar on the rear. Maybe maybe maybe a super small 17 or 19
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Old 09-07-2020, 09:29 PM   #4
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A hollow bar does not lose much stiffness. D^4, yadda.
I would not put more than a 19 on the rear unless I was road racing, and it was a last resort.
On the front I prefer a 23 over a 25.
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Old 09-07-2020, 10:07 PM   #5
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That too. All these rear bars are way too big. I like 25/19 on my 940 although it's still too much rear bar. I think we run 23/16 on the race 245. Whatever the biggest factory front and smallest factory rear are. The 900 gets more sway bar because it's a big couch of a machine.
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Old 09-07-2020, 10:10 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by doucheNozzle View Post
I would never put a bar on the rear. Maybe maybe maybe a super small 17 or 19
Quote:
Originally Posted by mikep View Post
A hollow bar does not lose much stiffness. D^4, yadda.
I would not put more than a 19 on the rear unless I was road racing, and it was a last resort.
On the front I prefer a 23 over a 25.
Can you guys help out and explain?
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Old 09-07-2020, 10:12 PM   #7
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With more rear sway bar you lose what little traction you have on corner exit due to lack of rear suspension articulation. This is an especially big deal with an open diff.
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Old 09-07-2020, 10:23 PM   #8
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Good reading on hollow sway bars: http://terminator-cobra.com/Sway%20Bar%20Tech.pdf



Did some math using these and the dimensions I had on hand (940 front sway bar, just an example)

27 mm bar with 0.188" wall thickness (wall thickness admittedly pulled out of my butt/stolen from Hotchkis in that PDF):

482.56 lb/in torsional stiffness (please note this isn't at the wheel, motion ratio from wheel to end link applies)

25 mm solid bar:

430.63 lb/in torsional stiffness

OD^4 trumps all, indeed.
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Old 09-08-2020, 10:55 AM   #9
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claculator with slidey thingies
https://www.addco.net/sway-bar-calculator/

How to measure with corner weights
https://www.hotrod.com/articles/a-me...your-sway-bar/
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Old 09-08-2020, 11:22 AM   #10
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27mm rear. thats got to be absolutely atrocious.
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Old 09-08-2020, 12:22 PM   #11
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For when you want your 240 to lift the inside rear like a GTI.
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Old 09-08-2020, 01:28 PM   #12
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interesting, thanks.

ipd sells the front and rears together, with
25-25
or
25-22
combos.

for a good compromise on a fun street car, stock height,
25mm front and the 19mm I have from a 79GT vs 25mm front and nothing?
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Old 09-08-2020, 02:55 PM   #13
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Would a stiff rear sway bar be good for drifting?
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Old 09-08-2020, 03:32 PM   #14
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I have the old 25 IPD one on my 940 and I wouldn't go any thicker as that's almost too much already for daily street driving.

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For when you want your 240 to lift the inside rear like a GTI.
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Old 09-08-2020, 03:42 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fred Gwynne View Post
Would a stiff rear sway bar be good for drifting?
only if you want to be the slowest car at the drift event with unpredictable behavior.
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Old 09-08-2020, 06:18 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fred Gwynne View Post
Would a stiff rear sway bar be good for drifting?
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Originally Posted by blkaplan View Post
only if you want to be the slowest car at the drift event with unpredictable behavior.
Initially a welded diff with a big bar and 60psi will get you sideways, but it's really slow. It's predictably sideways, so it can be used to teach you slide control. That becomes a hindrance as you get better at drifting and want to do more high speed skids.

I'm currently running no rear bar, 235-255 width rear tires at 30psi, and I still want more rear grip!
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Old 09-09-2020, 09:25 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by culberro View Post
Initially a welded diff with a big bar and 60psi will get you sideways, but it's really slow. It's predictably sideways, so it can be used to teach you slide control. That becomes a hindrance as you get better at drifting and want to do more high speed skids.

I'm currently running no rear bar, 235-255 width rear tires at 30psi, and I still want more rear grip!
Thanks!
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Old 09-09-2020, 10:46 AM   #18
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The 27mm hollow tube works out very close to the 25mm solid bar so comprable stiffness with less weight.
They have been on my dads donkey 240 for a couple of years and work perfectly fine on it. The balance feels good and much reduced body roll. Gaz adjustable dampers front and rear, 40mm lowering springs front and cargo springs rear.
I prefer a little less bar at the rear compared to front. 240's do not drive nice with no rear bar and the thicker the front one is the worse if feels and the more the car will sway and fish tail.
Anti roll bars are a final suspension refinement and does greatly come down to driver preference
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Old 09-09-2020, 04:31 PM   #19
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It seems like a basic "How suspensions are tuned" might be in order with many of these threads. I am by no means an expert, but I have a pretty good handle of the maths involved and pretty decent practical experience if all you want is a car that handles well, and that you can exploit with confidence.

In a nutshell, suspension tuning is the science of managing weight transfer. Traction at the tire pretty much dictates how far you can go. Less traction? You have to have "softer" suspension. More traction? You need "stiffer" suspension. Obviously, there is a crapload more to it than just this, but it's a really, really good starting point. Got a 27mm rear bar on 205 section width Nankang Lion Claws or whatever? Yeah, I bet it's sketchy as hell. Likewise, running slicks with stock springs, shocks, and sways and I bet it rolls over like a 5 dollar prostitute when the sailors come to town.

It is, after all, called a suspension "system". It's about balance, grasshopper.
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