Turbo-ing a B200E, NA K-Jet

The flywheel you linked means you would need the older type of turbo clutch. Doing down to a 215mm clutch also means the pressure plate has to work harder and stiffer pedal.
It is more common to go bigger say from the 228mm to 240mm but again means spending.

classicswede said:

The flywheel you linked means you would need the older type of turbo clutch. Doing down to a 215mm clutch also means the pressure plate has to work harder and stiffer pedal.
It is more common to go bigger say from the 228mm to 240mm but again means spending.

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Yeahhh... But wait, RetroTurbo also sell *this* : http://www.retroturbo.com/?product=b230-b200-b23-crankshaft-pulley-with-crankshaft-wheel

Needless to say, wont be hard to ditch the 123 when I'll have the money

I didnt knew all of that about clutch weight. I LOVE the clutch in my car, it feels soooo light ! Cable driven, the travel is short, grabs well, its linear and all. Way better than most of the new cars I had to drive (especially FWD hatch, tho I drove a series 1 diesel Bimmer and the clutch was sool heavy but grippy too.

Speaking of clutch...

Will I need a new clutch ? The one I have rn have like, 50k km on it... And I don't think I'll have much budget left for a turbo clutch or something. Will the stock NA clutch handle the 150/160 whp im aiming for ?

No the stock n/a clutch won't handle that power. However, the stock Volvo 228mm dished flywheel clutch will.

dl242gt said:

No the stock n/a clutch won't handle that power. However, the stock Volvo 228mm dished flywheel clutch will.

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Is that a direct fit ? Will I need a new pressure plate too ? Any modifications needed ?
This type of clutch ? http://www.kgtrimning.org/700-ser/clutchgearbox/clutch-kit/ks1505.html
http://www.kgtrimning.org/200-ser-1/clutchgearbox/drive-plates/lm610.html without the pressure plate (with such kind of price difference idk.. might pick up the whole thing, tho I might go over budget by a lot...

Sorry for my ignorance

edit : for the rod, I think I'll go with these. A bit pricey but known quality http://www.kgtrimning.org/tuning-special/b18b20b30/crankset/verdi-h-profile-connecting-rod.html

Your flywheel should already be the dished flywheel. From 87 and newer our 240s had the dished flywheel. The stock turbo version of the dished clutch is a direct fit. Won't need a performance clutch. The cheapest clutch for you would be a stock replacement from somewhere like Skandix or another stock parts supplier like CVI automotive.

What I mean is just buy a stock replacement turbo clutch kit. Like one for a 1988 740 turbo. The kit will have pressure plate, disc, and throwout bearing. The nicer kits also include the pilot bearing and alignment tool. Be sure to replace the pilot bearing if the kit you buy doesn't have it.

dl242gt said:

Your flywheel should already be the dished flywheel. From 87 and newer our 240s had the dished flywheel. The stock turbo version of the dished clutch is a direct fit. Won't need a performance clutch. The cheapest clutch for you would be a stock replacement from somewhere like Skandix or another stock parts supplier like CVI automotive.

What I mean is just buy a stock replacement turbo clutch kit. Like one for a 1988 740 turbo. The kit will have pressure plate, disc, and throwout bearing. The nicer kits also include the pilot bearing and alignment tool. Be sure to replace the pilot bearing if the kit you buy doesn't have it.

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That's nice to know, I'll check Skandix. I love the site but its pricey. I didn't knew about dished flywheel. I often wont trust infos in english as its mostly from the US and that the US had different options N' stuff. Like no cat, simple K Jet (no lambda) would be unthinkable in the states. LH is kinda rare here, AC wasn't a common thing and most engines are 2L. The 2.3s started popping around in 940. Why ? Cuz it makes the insurance price jump, and im not even talking about turbo car ahah. Here a 2.3L is considered a big engine...

Anyway, I'll check price.
I need to make a budget approx soon, cuz now I can't keep up track of what it's going to cost me.. prob more than what I've wanted to throw at it. Issue gon be convincing the parents that, yes, I know how to use my *own* money and no, im *not stupid*

Edit : damn, im over budget and by a lot, its going to cost me around 2500 euros

Okay, some much needed updates (yeah ik double post)

I've received the turbo and manifold !
The thing is in okay condition for the price. Its a pre 90 manifold (not the best flowing one, I might sand down a lil bit its inside, cuz im bored)

There is a lil bit of play in the turbine but it spins freely. I'll get a rebuild kit.

Its a Garett T03, AR 42, standard one ofc. Adjustable wastegate too, but I wonder, should I be able to move the arm with the turbo sitting there on the floor ? Looks a bit rusty, I'll dive into that to see if the actuator can be saved or not. The thing came with the oil feed and return hoses, but only the part that is bolted to the unit, not the full thing.

I wanted to unbolt it from the manifold but I don't have the correct socket, looks like double hex. Can I reuse the bolts ? I also have a stuborn worn out stud on the exhaust size and a broken stud somewhere else.

What should I know before continuing this ? I've found a nice 740 intercooler for 40 euros (shipping included). I now need to order a socket set for it.

I didn't knew volvo's turbo were watercooled, good thing imo.

I'll take it all later on, for now I've sprayed oil on the thing to protect it from rusting more. Its really dirty, its not rusty at all excepted on the flange of the manifold and that actuator thingy (the grey-ish can with the rubber tubing from the air side)

Im a hugeee turbo noob really...
As for downpipes, are they different types of flange type ect...? Also Im missing most of the studs/bolts, are these easy to source ?

For the turbo mounting bolts use a 12 point socket There should be a locking plate that is tapped down onto the bolt heads and has folded over tabs on the ends. Sometimes you can save them but they usually break when you go to remove them. Not sure if any of that is available anymore. Soak the bolts for a day or so. They are very tight and use a long breaker bar with a strong socket. Maybe a pipe on there for extra leverage.

You can test the wastegate actuator with a small pump like what is used to test coolant systems. Or even a bicycle pump could work. I would disconnect the actuator from the swing arm and make sure the swing arm moves freely. All of these turbos use the same downpipe flange size. It is about 2.25" opening. You can use a 740 or 940 one if you can find that easier.

You can buy the clutch here in the US pretty easily. Try FCP Euro, Eeuroparts, or Rockauto.
For hardware I'd suggest using the Skandix site or CVI automotive. Classic Swede in the UK can probably help with hardware, too. Try to get the upper and lower mounting brackets for the intercooler. You will need them to install it. The air handling hoses will work from the 740 as long as they are from a 91 and older.

dl242gt said:

For the turbo mounting bolts use a 12 point socket There should be a locking plate that is tapped down onto the bolt heads and has folded over tabs on the ends. Sometimes you can save them but they usually break when you go to remove them. Not sure if any of that is available anymore. Soak the bolts for a day or so. They are very tight and use a long breaker bar with a strong socket. Maybe a pipe on there for extra leverage.

You can test the wastegate actuator with a small pump like what is used to test coolant systems. Or even a bicycle pump could work. I would disconnect the actuator from the swing arm and make sure the swing arm moves freely. All of these turbos use the same downpipe flange size. It is about 2.25" opening. You can use a 740 or 940 one if you can find that easier.

You can buy the clutch here in the US pretty easily. Try FCP Euro, Eeuroparts, or Rockauto.
For hardware I'd suggest using the Skandix site or CVI automotive. Classic Swede in the UK can probably help with hardware, too. Try to get the upper and lower mounting brackets for the intercooler. You will need them to install it. The air handling hoses will work from the 740 as long as they are from a 91 and older.

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Thanks for the info
Clutch kit will cost 200e, its okay imo.
Being in France allow me to buy from Skandix and KG Trimning for cheap, which is good but I don't have access to any JY to pull parts from it.
The mounts cost quite some money, I'll see if I can buy from Ebay but I doubt that...
My turbo does have the locking plate. I ordered a nice set of 12 points, I'll use my 600mm breaker bar (its a good quality one).

Thanks for the tip for the actuator ! I have until may to source parts, and I'll have 4 months worth of weekends to complete the swap anyway so im not worried. Ima head to the garage and soak these bolts in WD special yeahp. I have a nice bike pump with a gauge and I know its pretty accurate (I've tested it against 3 different gauges).

If I understand correctly, the actuator arm is adjustable to change the pressure at which it open to let go the pressure, right ?

As for the downpipe, I can get one brand new for 50e, and 300e for a complete turbo set from KG, tho im not sure about the shipping...

With me planning on running E85, is there an issue with using regular steel exhaust ? I've read that it'll rust out super fast, but once again, when talking about E85 a lotta peoples have different opinions. Im sold on the idea of using it, as its 3 times cheaper than regular here...

Also, is this the correct manifold for a +T ? I can get this one for really cheap from the guy who sold me the turbo

https://imgur.com/MD4ua2h
https://imgur.com/MW9X2En

Try sourcing used parts from Sweden? The intake will need to be the one with a 3 bar fuel pressure regulator. That looks ok to use. The only main differences are the injectors if they are turbo or n/a ones and the pressure regulator. The other main difference is the whether it has a cold start valve. If you have a very cold winter. Then you may want the cold start valve.

Stock volvo turbo injectors will need ballast resisters as they are low impedance injectors.

dl242gt said:

Try sourcing used parts from Sweden? The intake will need to be the one with a 3 bar fuel pressure regulator. That looks ok to use. The only main differences are the injectors if they are turbo or n/a ones and the pressure regulator. The other main difference is the whether it has a cold start valve. If you have a very cold winter. Then you may want the cold start valve.

Stock volvo turbo injectors will need ballast resisters as they are low impedance injectors.

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The shipping cost from Sweden are going to be a bit more expensive than from France (we are talking triple the price for shipping)

I don't think this one have the cold start valve. The winters aren't cold, almost never bellow freezing. Going to E85 means crappy winter start anyway so I don't know much...

I do plan on swapping the injector anyway. I think I'll go with Bosch 420cc high impedance yes. These injectors indeed need 3 bars. Can I get a 3 bar pressure regulator to fit this NA manifold (that comes with a 2.5) with changing the whole fuel rail ? Also the K Jet pumps wont be an issue with their 6+ bars ? I have a faulty fuel pressure accumulator, is there a kit or something to put in place of the said accumulator ? I kinda like the K Jet fuel filter in the engine bay. Its handy to change.

Thx for the infos, looks like I did my research right


Edit/update : starting to take care of that turbo, has really little play in it, looks good but im having an issue with an exhaust flange stud thats stuck in there really hard ahah. I removed the backplate that carries the blow off valve itself, its moving freely. The bolt is on it. I had to break one of the nuts tho. I wont reuse the nuts ofc but plan on reusing the studs, they look good, no rust at all/clean thread. The actuator thingy/grey-ish can with a hose on it seems to work, but its dirty. I tested it using my bike pump. It looks sealed, idk if it can be rebuilt or not. Figure out I'll leave it alone.

Found some nice OE Garrett T3 rebuild kit, a bit on the expensive side (around 80e I figure) but hey. I can't afford a cartridge and the blades of the turbo looks really good. It was working when the guy pulled out of the car so hey.

You won't need a cold start valve. It actually varies from year to year whether the cars use one or not. So you'll be fine. The 3 bar regulator interchanges with the 2.5 if that is what is on the manifold. You could also shop around Germany and the UK for parts. There were a lot of Volvos sold in those countries.

You won't need the accumulator. If it isn't leaking just keep using the setup. If it's leaking then you can delete it. You can make up something using the original fittings in some new fuel line. I'd search around the board. There are threads about deleting the accumulator. The fuel pump will be fine as the pressure will be regulated on the fuel rail.

You will also want to search on the board for threads where people have drilled the block for the oil return or they put fittings in the oil pan to return the oil from the turbo. For the oil feed you could either drill the block where the stock feed goes or replace the plug on the end of the oil galley near the water pump with a fitting and feed the oil from there with -4AN line.

dl242gt said:

You won't need a cold start valve. It actually varies from year to year whether the cars use one or not. So you'll be fine. The 3 bar regulator interchanges with the 2.5 if that is what is on the manifold. You could also shop around Germany and the UK for parts. There were a lot of Volvos sold in those countries.

You won't need the accumulator. If it isn't leaking just keep using the setup. If it's leaking then you can delete it. You can make up something using the original fittings in some new fuel line. I'd search around the board. There are threads about deleting the accumulator. The fuel pump will be fine as the pressure will be regulated on the fuel rail.

You will also want to search on the board for threads where people have drilled the block for the oil return or they put fittings in the oil pan to return the oil from the turbo. For the oil feed you could either drill the block where the stock feed goes or replace the plug on the end of the oil galley near the water pump with a fitting and feed the oil from there with -4AN line.

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Thanks for the help.

I'll drill the block since I plan on doing a full engine refresh, I can't really weld so oil pan is out of the question. I'll look it up later when I'll be down to it. As for the oil feed I'll see later when the turbo rebuilt will be done. I'm def getting a high volume oil pump (the one from the turbo models with the 30mm tall gears instead of 25)

Nice to know that I don't need this cold start non sense, they are pricey for what they are.

Also good to know that the pressure regulator is a simple swap, guess I'm ordering this manifold then.

I'll check the board about accumulator later, figure out its the least of my worries tbh.

Victorrr said:

Can the Microsquirt work as a fuel ECU only ?
I would need a flywheel position sensor + some power stage + a fixed dizzy nah ? So I would need a 60 - 2 flywheel, the sensor, ect.. ect..

Its costly.

I'll get there eventually yeah.. Is it possible to run the MS as a fuel only keeping the 123 until I find the money to go wasted spark LS coil ?

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Megasquirt can be triggered from methods other than a wheel. You can probably do it with your current distributor and have megasquirt/microsquirt fire the coil. If your distributor is a VR based unit you could probably wire a General Motors HEI module up and then have megasquirt command the HEI which would automatically handle coil dwell, if I remember correctly. You'd want to get the 7 or 8 pin HEI module which allows for a control signal from megasquirt to command the timing changes. You would also do something to prevent your distributor's advance mechanisms from moving.

I ran a megasquirt on a 1978 Yamaha motorcycle. I triggered off the motorcycle's coil, I didn't not try to control the timing. But I do not think it would have been very hard to do so.

I'm not sure what you need to do with your existing k-jet injectors, but others here have definitely done this type of conversion in the past, so they should know what to do.

In my opinion, megasquirt will give you much easier control over the engine from a tuning perspective. You would have a huge advantage over k-jet because megasquirt has a big and obvious footprint on the internet to learn from, and tuning can take place from a laptop. You will have a much faster "tune iteration cycle" than you would on k-jet. On K-jet, you probably have to at minimum open the hood of your car to make changes, but with megasquirt you can do it from the passenger seat while driving.

Hope that helps. Sorry that the better way isn't always the one with the smoothest path forward.

dmann said:

Megasquirt can be triggered from methods other than a wheel. You can probably do it with your current distributor and have megasquirt/microsquirt fire the coil. If your distributor is a VR based unit you could probably wire a General Motors HEI module up and then have megasquirt command the HEI which would automatically handle coil dwell, if I remember correctly. You'd want to get the 7 or 8 pin HEI module which allows for a control signal from megasquirt to command the timing changes. You would also do something to prevent your distributor's advance mechanisms from moving.

I ran a megasquirt on a 1978 Yamaha motorcycle. I triggered off the motorcycle's coil, I didn't not try to control the timing. But I do not think it would have been very hard to do so.

I'm not sure what you need to do with your existing k-jet injectors, but others here have definitely done this type of conversion in the past, so they should know what to do.

In my opinion, megasquirt will give you much easier control over the engine from a tuning perspective. You would have a huge advantage over k-jet because megasquirt has a big and obvious footprint on the internet to learn from, and tuning can take place from a laptop. You will have a much faster "tune iteration cycle" than you would on k-jet. On K-jet, you probably have to at minimum open the hood of your car to make changes, but with megasquirt you can do it from the passenger seat while driving.

Hope that helps. Sorry that the better way isn't always the one with the smoothest path forward.

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Yeah, I know ahah.

I've since changed my mind and will go with a Microsquirt setup. Megasquirt is a bit too expensive for me right now.

My dizzy is of the fully programmable type. It adjusts itself based on 2 curves, the RPM based one and the other one is ran from a build it MAP sensor (It handle both vacuum advance and boost retard).

I'm going to update you about my choices, since you seems to know the do's and don't.

For now I'll stick with my 123 dizzy, as its working great + I've spend 500 euros in it (coil and wires included) so I'm not ready to ditch it yet, I'll ditch it later on for a coil on plug method (I think Microsquirt handles that). So here are the parts and mods

Stock Garrett T3 turbo, I need to order the OE rebuild kit
740 intercooler
B230F na manifold, swapping the fuel regulator for a 3 bar one, keeping stock K Jet pumps and relay (less sure about the relay).
850 TPS with a special bracket for the B230 throttle body (for MS to know the load demand)
MAP sensor (since MicroS doesn't have one, I'll buy the one that came on MegaS and mount it somewhere ABOVE the engine (to avoid ruining the sensor), for MS to do its fuel magic
air intake temp sensor, ofc, and coolant temp sensor (I might do an E Fan mod, not sure)
MaxSpeed H Beam cuz I don't feel running 150+hp on stock 9mm rods
Mocal oil cooler and thermostat (sandwich plate)
Full engine rebuild (more like a refresh, I will measure the bore N' other stuff, hope to reuse the block...)
big fat injectors (around 420cc, to run E85).
2.5in exhaust, single muffler custom made, maybe the KG Trimning one if I can get it shipped.
It being a euro K Jet means it should have an A cam, will do for now. Hard to get used T cams here.
Power goal at least 150 reliable, maybe 170 for fun.
AEM Lambda gauge with its Bosch sensor, 0 - 5V output directly to MS.
Some boost/vacuum gauge of some sort alongside an oil temp gauge. No oil pressure gauge as its costly af (digital, cuz I'd rather avoid having hot oil lines going under the dash)


Btw I live in Europe so JY parts are mostly out of the question.

Support mods : IPD 25mil sway bars, bracings (lower and upper). Full bushing replacement (regular, I want a smooth ride so no poly + can't afford hem' anyway.

I know having a separate ignition and fueling is not the best but I can't afford to MS it all now, unless I can get REALLY good deals on most parts... which is hard.

I think I got it all, may have forgotten to add some details.

Edit : no need for an oil feed restrictor on the line going to the turbo ? I can't find anything about that on TB, either im using the search fonction wrong or its not needed

Edit 2 : found out that my exhaust mani is cracked.. Good news is its a pre 90 (the ones that isn't flowing as well as the later style) bad new is its gonna cost money to buy a new mani... Not that easy to get by around here. The crack isn't big but lets WD40 throught... Its like, an inch long and 0.5mm where its largest. Its on the flat part facing the engine, between the 4 bolts, dead center)... Can I JB weld the thing or something ? I really can't afford any of the new ones and I can't find used ones for good prices on Ebay...

No need for an oil restriction on a -4 AN oil feed with a TB03 turbo. With a crack in the old style manifold just get rid of it and get a 90+ one. I'm sure if you put a wanted listing on the forum you can get one from the US.

If tuning is really new to you. I would suggest investing a bit of money and time with member Linuxman51. He will get you going with good setup and support of the microsquirt.

PS Try contacting ClassicSwede. They sell used parts.

dl242gt said:

No need for an oil restriction on a -4 AN oil feed with a TB03 turbo. With a crack in the old style manifold just get rid of it and get a 90+ one. I'm sure if you put a wanted listing on the forum you can get one from the US.

If tuning is really new to you. I would suggest investing a bit of money and time with member Linuxman51. He will get you going with good setup and support of the microsquirt.

PS Try contacting ClassicSwede. They sell used parts.

Click to expand...

I've already checked classic swede. No manifold in sight...
Shipping from the US is going to be expensive for such heavy parts. I think I'd rather try to find some legit welders around here with the correct tools to fix it up... I know I won't be able to get a manifold from the US for less than 50?, shipping included.. no manifolds in sight on Ebay neither, only these chinese made ones.

Good to know as far as oil restrictor goes. Less parts = happy me.

I'll remember to contact this guy, thanks for the hint. I'm indeed new to tuning ^^

Edit : just saw a 90+ manifold on eBay.. 130? + 90? shipping. Nah. No way. I'm getting mine welded.

Have you ever checked out the process to properly weld cast iron? By the time you are done. You will have spent that much money on a poorly flowing manifold that are prone to warping. The runners on those manifolds are separated and it is very common for them to warp which will require refacing the end with the ports on it. In fact that will need to be done after you weld it to make sure it is all even with the cylinder head.

I suggest being a bit more patient and look around for awhile and you will find what you need. Long ago when I wanted to intercool my 240 turbo it took me months to get all the parts together. You have plenty of time to gather all the parts to get ready.