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#1 |
Eisen-Stein
Join Date: Oct 2016
Location: Morgantown, WV/Your mom's house
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![]() So I'm pretty familiar with the vaunted "Poi-shift" box used by many guys for running the white block auto trans or aristo trans.
I am contemplating doing a budget LS build this summer and would like to go the 4l80e route to save money. From my reading, it seems like the 4l80 operates on the same principles as the AW30-40 (a combination of solenoids on/off will select gears). The 4l80 also has a lockup converter, which is operated by a third, independent solenoid (lockup in all gears if you're feeling frisky). Realistically, couldn't I control those solenoids with a microcontroller, two momentary switches, and a microcontroller (the same way ya'll run the 30-40)? For the lockup, you could just add an on/off switch somewhere convenient that can directly actuate the solenoid or use the Arduino to control it. Also, I'm 75% certain the Arduino (or other MC) (with the correct circuitry to step up/down the 12v and 5v signals) could be used to control line pressure on these. The 4l80 EPC (line pressure solenoid) operates using PWM typically. When there's no power to it, full line pressure is given. There are two routes I suspect you could go: the first being a potentiometer read by the Arduino to set a fixed line pressure, the second using some coding/graphing to read TPS, gear position, and lockup condition to vary the line pressure based on perceived load. Does any of that make sense? |
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#2 |
Board Member
![]() Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: PDX
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![]() buy a microsquirt box to control it
https://www.efisource.com/wp/shop/4l...-control-unit/ what engine is it behind? |
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#3 | |
Eisen-Stein
Join Date: Oct 2016
Location: Morgantown, WV/Your mom's house
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![]() Quote:
If I can build something that meets my needs for $50, why bother spending $450 for a closed-source solution that doesn't do what I want? Going behind the cheapest non-windowed LS I can find. |
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#4 |
Board Member
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Weare, NH
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![]() but why?
__________________
1985 740GLE sedan winter beater Cali car. |
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#5 |
Board Member
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Marionville, Ontario, Canada
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![]() You can TOTALLY run a 4L80e with a POI shift. The key bit of information is whether or not the solenoids require a ground signal or a 12v feed. The AW30-40 solenoids require 12v, since they ground at the case. That's why the POI shift box has all the extra transistors and such. If the 4L80E only requires a ground output to control the solenoids, you could easily do it with only the microcontroller part of the POI recipe. The BASIC stamp that's used is only there to send the signals, so for sub-$50 you could get a BASIC Stamp from Parallax, and have it firing your transmission in minutes...with almost no soldering.
An arduino could do the same thing, but as a non-coder, I've had zero success at finding functional 'shifting' code for one that rivals the simplicity of the POI box. The Speeduino crowd has a gear controller that uses an Arduino mega...but again, it gets needlessly complex for no reason, IMO. If you can fight through the muck, and again, if the 4L80e solenoids only need grounds, you could TECHNICALLY shift it with a $15 chinese Arduino Mega256 clone. IMO, the POI shift is the way to go. The DxControl-Gears from the Speeduino crowd is not worth it yet. It can only do manual shifting currently anyway, and seems like a dead project. [edit]HA, it looks like the solenoids use a switched ground. It would be CAKE to do with a POI shift, IMO. The only other thing you'd need to do is make sure that when in 'D', there's a ground signal going to the POI box, to let the controller know it's time to work. http://www.msgpio.com/manuals/mshift/4L80E/4L80e.html
__________________
1984 244/ B6304S+T / AW30-40 w/Poi-Shift. Last edited by Broke4speed; 10-29-2019 at 10:49 AM.. |
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#6 |
Eisen-Stein
Join Date: Oct 2016
Location: Morgantown, WV/Your mom's house
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#7 |
BRANDSCHUTZVORSCHRIFTEN!
![]() Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: mont, AL
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![]() a microsquirt and a little bit of wiring, then you can have poi shift when you want it, or normal automatic otherwise. It already supports switched inputs to trigger up shift/downshift.
if you want to do it cheaper (and spend more time), get a GPIO board to do the same thing, but you're only saving a little bit to go that route. much faster and easier to use the micro.
__________________
"They bum rushed them in their own crib, they drank all their beer, they partied with their ladies and they left with the trophy" Now with in-house Dyno tuning! Megasquirt Tuning! Plug and play LH 2.4 Megasquirt, now with stealth mode! |
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#8 |
Board Member
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Weare, NH
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#9 |
Board Member
![]() Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: PDX
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![]() it sounds like you don't legitimately have the cash to somewhat properly do what you want to do and actually have it work well. Keep it stock.
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#10 |
Board Member
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Marionville, Ontario, Canada
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![]() So because someone wants to do it on the cheap, they're not able to do it properly?
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#11 |
Board Member
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: Czech Republic
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#12 |
BRANDSCHUTZVORSCHRIFTEN!
![]() Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: mont, AL
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#13 | |
Eisen-Stein
Join Date: Oct 2016
Location: Morgantown, WV/Your mom's house
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![]() Quote:
I'd much rather build something myself for $50 that does what I want it to (and I know how to fix it and build it) than feed DIYAutotune $450 more for something that cost them ~$50 to manufacture. If I'm going to spend that kind of money, I'd rather sink $450 into a good exhaust system or partially fund a set of better-breathing heads. |
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#14 | |
Eisen-Stein
Join Date: Oct 2016
Location: Morgantown, WV/Your mom's house
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![]() Quote:
I know 3 guys from this forum (Broke4speed, roadracer4life, the Poi) who have awesome builds that rely heavily on the DIY push-button shift controller outlined above. I was looking for some corroboration/collaboration on an idea that is actually feasible. |
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#15 |
Board Member
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Marionville, Ontario, Canada
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![]() The POI shift would work, definitely
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#16 |
Eisen-Stein
Join Date: Oct 2016
Location: Morgantown, WV/Your mom's house
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#17 | |
BRANDSCHUTZVORSCHRIFTEN!
![]() Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: mont, AL
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#18 |
BRANDSCHUTZVORSCHRIFTEN!
![]() Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: mont, AL
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![]() If this is meant to replace the gm native stuff in the ecu, I think you'd be better off just ditching it entirely and getting an aftermarket controller that can (inexpensively) do what you want vs hoping the gm ecu doesn't get mad when it starts seeing rpm/mph mismatches and what not.
If the concern is DIY, the gpio is a b&g thing that diy just re-sells.. but I reckon at this stage in the game your time isn't really worth anything, so whatevs lol |
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#19 | |
Eisen-Stein
Join Date: Oct 2016
Location: Morgantown, WV/Your mom's house
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![]() Quote:
I'll do some reading on GPIO, but my time is indeed worthless. |
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#20 |
BRANDSCHUTZVORSCHRIFTEN!
![]() Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: mont, AL
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![]() I would still do the gpio. it's more of a kit, but still integrates well via canbus. you can have the flappy paddles, and still have normal auto mode.
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#21 |
Chubfest 2009 Survivor
![]() Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: The neighborhood with the ******* guitar player.
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![]() Just get a 700r4 then.
__________________
Hank Scorpio is from the Simpsons. You can call me Doug ;) Will trade guitars/guitar parts for go fast goodies or stuff I need. Just PM. www.kauerguitars.com the second best way to upset neighbors and alienate people. History: Car 1 (242) | Car 2 (t5r) | Car 3 (255) |
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#22 |
Board Member
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Marionville, Ontario, Canada
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![]() If you want manual without the TCU hassle, check out http://www.radesignsproducts.com/rail-controller.html. They have a couple manual shift options for the 4L80E, and are pretty cheap.
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#23 |
BRANDSCHUTZVORSCHRIFTEN!
![]() Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: mont, AL
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#24 | |
BRANDSCHUTZVORSCHRIFTEN!
![]() Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: mont, AL
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#25 |
Eisen-Stein
Join Date: Oct 2016
Location: Morgantown, WV/Your mom's house
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