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Old 12-24-2019, 10:47 AM   #851
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manual brakes suck in a street car.
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Old 12-24-2019, 02:06 PM   #852
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I thought a properly designed manual brake system is awesome as it provides several orders of magnitude of leverage with superior pedal feel. I was persuaded by what I’ve read to start collecting parts for that future delete. Tilton or Wilwood pedals.
A properly designed manual setup will have great feel, but it will require more effort to stop. Most manual pedal ratios are 5:1 to 6:1. A stock 240 is 4:1 (really stiff) but then they add a 4:1 or 5:1 booster, so the total leverage ratio is 16 or 20:1.

Disconnect your booster and that will give you a good idea of what a full manual setup is like. It's not bad when driving aggressively (I prefer it) , it's just not fun in stop and go traffic or if your stopped on a hill.

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Pretty sure a manual system is always going to have a harder pedal feel when compared to a similar booster system. There’s just no way to get better leverage without a longer pedal throw, unless you add some kind of assist.
You should try driving a car with properly setup manual brakes. If it has a street oriented pad, they're really nice. You just have to get over the habit of lightly pressing on the pedal to scrub speed. It takes some force.
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Old 12-24-2019, 05:09 PM   #853
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Originally Posted by culberro View Post
A properly designed manual setup will have great feel, but it will require more effort to stop. Most manual pedal ratios are 5:1 to 6:1. A stock 240 is 4:1 (really stiff) but then they add a 4:1 or 5:1 booster, so the total leverage ratio is 16 or 20:1.

Disconnect your booster and that will give you a good idea of what a full manual setup is like. It's not bad when driving aggressively (I prefer it) , it's just not fun in stop and go traffic or if your stopped on a hill.



You should try driving a car with properly setup manual brakes. If it has a street oriented pad, they're really nice. You just have to get over the habit of lightly pressing on the pedal to scrub speed. It takes some force.
Yeah, that's what I don't want - high pedal effort. I get that the feel and consistency is nice with proper manual brakes, but most of my driving with this car is to and from work on mostly city streets. I'm actually hoping the 7" dual diaphragm booster will give me more assist than the stock 9" single diaphragm.
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Old 12-24-2019, 06:07 PM   #854
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You could always do a hydro boost as well. I'm sure you could just use a electric pump out of a Volvo on it too and mount it remotely to clean up the engine bay. That is if you don't have power steering
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Old 12-25-2019, 06:37 PM   #855
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You could always do a hydro boost as well. I'm sure you could just use a electric pump out of a Volvo on it too and mount it remotely to clean up the engine bay. That is if you don't have power steering
I'll get the 7" booster in there and see how things are looking. The hydroboost could be a plan b, but I don't want to a a pump and hydro system if I don't have to.
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Old 12-26-2019, 10:44 AM   #856
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Wait! Tyler! you're putting a 16V in your 140? I want to do the same with mine. Following
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Old 12-26-2019, 12:45 PM   #857
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Wait! Tyler! you're putting a 16V in your 140? I want to do the same with mine. Following
Yeah, but it's a long way from running. I'm still mocking things up with the 16v head on the old block. Once that's all done I'll need to build the B230 block I have and at least freshen up the head.
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Old 12-26-2019, 08:33 PM   #858
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I’ll go back and read your thread but where’d you get your motor mounts for upright b230? Josh?
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Old 12-26-2019, 11:34 PM   #859
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I’ll go back and read your thread but where’d you get your motor mounts for upright b230? Josh?
No, I made some out of 240 torque rods. I actually have an unused set of YoshiFab mounts if you’re in the market.
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Old 12-27-2019, 12:50 AM   #860
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No, I made some out of 240 torque rods. I actually have an unused set of YoshiFab mounts if you’re in the market.
Maybe. Did you figure out why josh’s mounts didnt hold the motor quite right??
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Old 12-29-2019, 04:51 PM   #861
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Maybe. Did you figure out why josh’s mounts didnt hold the motor quite right??
The mounts that I didn't like were the adapters he used to sell. Now he makes a full-on mount bracket that I think fits really well. I just didn't use them because I made my own.
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Old 12-29-2019, 05:07 PM   #862
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Still chipping away at this thing, 20 minutes at a time between baby's naps.

I adapted the brake booster bracket (shortened slightly and made a new flange) to fit the 7" booster. I'll have to shorten the threaded rod from the pedal to the booster.





The stock 140 booster has 3.25" bolt spacing for the master. This new booster has 3 3/8" spacing. I was able to enlarge the holes on the Volvo master, but I don't feel great about the amount of material left.

Finding a new master cylinder with the proper bolt spacing and the right bore is probably the right call.
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Old 12-29-2019, 08:26 PM   #863
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Originally Posted by Tfrasca View Post
The mounts that I didn't like were the adapters he used to sell. Now he makes a full-on mount bracket that I think fits really well. I just didn't use them because I made my own.
PM sent regarding the mounts

Last edited by xmlhack; 12-29-2019 at 08:40 PM..
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Old 01-02-2020, 12:45 AM   #864
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Originally Posted by Tfrasca View Post
Still chipping away at this thing, 20 minutes at a time between baby's naps.

I adapted the brake booster bracket (shortened slightly and made a new flange) to fit the 7" booster. I'll have to shorten the threaded rod from the pedal to the booster.

The stock 140 booster has 3.25" bolt spacing for the master. This new booster has 3 3/8" spacing. I was able to enlarge the holes on the Volvo master, but I don't feel great about the amount of material left.

Finding a new master cylinder with the proper bolt spacing and the right bore is probably the right call.
Is the original master cylinder cast iron or steel? Let us know what unit you choose. I'm pretty much ready to fix my 142 and this may be a far more reasonable and reliable solution than rebuilding the original unit.
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Old 01-02-2020, 09:39 AM   #865
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Is the original master cylinder cast iron or steel? Let us know what unit you choose. I'm pretty much ready to fix my 142 and this may be a far more reasonable and reliable solution than rebuilding the original unit.
Stock MC is cast iron. I've been looking for a suitable replacement with the right bolt spacing for the new booster and have yet to find anything, other than a $300 Wilwood. What are you trying to fix with your brakes? I have a nearly new booster that I bought from hiperfauto last year...
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Old 01-02-2020, 12:10 PM   #866
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Originally Posted by Tfrasca View Post
Stock MC is cast iron. I've been looking for a suitable replacement with the right bolt spacing for the new booster and have yet to find anything, other than a $300 Wilwood. What are you trying to fix with your brakes? I have a nearly new booster that I bought from hiperfauto last year...
My booster is leaking REAL bad.
I’ll send you a PM
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Old 01-04-2020, 11:02 PM   #867
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Welp, I thought I was making progress with the Cosworth intake manifold. I was under the impression that it just needed a Volvo flange welded on, and everything would line up. I started cutting out a flange and decided to check that. The port spacing on the Volvo head is way wider than the Cosworth. Widening the manifold in the middle would help a little, but ideally each runner would get material added between them.

So now I'm looking at the feasibility of that vs. building one from scratch. So dumb.

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Old 01-05-2020, 10:47 AM   #868
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What about just using a shortened Volvo intake? Still not short enough?
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Old 01-05-2020, 10:49 AM   #869
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Or make a new plenum flange and weld Volvo runners to it
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Old 01-05-2020, 11:44 AM   #870
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What about just using a shortened Volvo intake? Still not short enough?
I have a shortened one here (for a 240) and it's not even close. I could take another inch or so out of the runners, but even then I don't think it'll fit and the TB position would have to be moved still. Figured I could do something else and sell the shortened Volvo manifold to a 240 person.

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Or make a new plenum flange and weld Volvo runners to it
Yeah, maybe. I'd want to have velocity stacks sticking into the plenum like on the Cosworth manifold though, which would be tricky with the oval Volvo runners. The Cosworth one is nice because the transition from oval to round stacks is in the casting.
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Old 01-06-2020, 01:50 PM   #871
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I missed the bit about the Cosworth manifold. Which engine is it from, a YB? Sierra or Escort?

Curious what the goal is with adapting it to the 16V Redblock. What does it offer, other than not having to make the whole thing from scratch (which may still be simpler)?
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Old 01-06-2020, 08:07 PM   #872
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I missed the bit about the Cosworth manifold. Which engine is it from, a YB? Sierra or Escort?

Curious what the goal is with adapting it to the 16V Redblock. What does it offer, other than not having to make the whole thing from scratch (which may still be simpler)?
That's it, just didn't want to make a new one from scratch. The scales are tipping as I find more issues with the Cosworth manifold, though.

The thing I like about it is how the cast velocity stacks/runners allow for such a tight plenum. As usual, brake booster clearance is the issue, even with the new 7" booster.

Assuming I could flatten round tubing into appropriately shaped ovals, I could basically replicate this manifold rather than trying to adapt it. That's starting to look like the thing to do. Oh, and I would need to find aluminum velocity stacks, because I really don't want to make them like I did for the 8 valve.

edit: the manifold is from a YB Sierra, as far as I know.
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Old 01-06-2020, 08:22 PM   #873
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Originally Posted by Tfrasca View Post

Assuming I could flatten round tubing into appropriately shaped ovals, I could basically replicate this manifold rather than trying to adapt it. That's starting to look like the thing to do. Oh, and I would need to find aluminum velocity stacks, because I really don't want to make them like I did for the 8 valve.
Xcessive Manufacturing carries a lot of DIY parts for intakes. You could probably piece enough bits together to make it work out.

https://xcessivemanufacturing.com/re...ty-stacks.html

I'll probably end up using their parts the next time I need to build an intake.
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Old 01-06-2020, 08:27 PM   #874
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Originally Posted by culberro View Post
Xcessive Manufacturing carries a lot of DIY parts for intakes. You could probably piece enough bits together to make it work out.

https://xcessivemanufacturing.com/re...ty-stacks.html

I'll probably end up using their parts the next time I need to build an intake.
REALLY good to know, thanks. I'd been looking mostly at Ross Machine Racing and not finding exactly what I need. Also, seeing those cast stacks makes me realize I can just cut the stacks off my already hacked up Cosworth manifold!
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Old 01-06-2020, 08:29 PM   #875
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+1 on Xcessive. A friend just received an order for a custom intake going on his Beams swapped 77 celica, flanges, molded stacks, base plate, runners, they all look fantastic and should allow for easy fabrication.
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