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Is this ping? WTF.

beepee

beepee

how hard can it be?
Joined
Sep 25, 2008
Location
Southern MD
So, just a refresher for everyone - My car was blown up at Mangohick on the dyno. Wastegate was set improperly, hit nearly 30 psi.... and developed a nasty knock. But it made it 100+ miles home (naturally aspirated, heh).

By the time I made it home, the knock was completely gone. But I parked the car and it's been waiting for a heart transplant. Draining the oil resulted in a nice fine mixture of redblockW-30. So, it's been sitting for a while, and I finally have all my parts and pieces (well, I thought I did) so I began pulling things apart...

I've had a productive evening:


Despite some unwilling tools...


...progress was made!


And, here's what I found.








:omg::omg::omg::omg:



So, WTF. Is all of that possible from ping/knock? I swear it almost looks like something played an all-metallic version of powerball in there...

Maybe something snuck in when the hoses blew off on the dyno? :???:
 
Eh looks like foreign object damage to me.

That said, not having some form of overboost fuel cut is... unwise... just IMO.

On the dyno I start at wastegate pressure with overboost set 20kpa above that. I work up 20kpa at a time, adjusting the fuel cut up as I go.

Usually at least once during a dyno session I turn the boost up and forget the overboost setting and violently hit fuel cut at 4000rpm. It's good to make the dyno operator **** himself at least once per session. heheh.

I dunno if you can adjust that tuning LH, if not I'd consider using an adjustable pressure switch to cut power to the FP relay.
 
Captain Bondo said:
Eh looks like foreign object damage to me.
Click to expand...

That's what I thought as well. I just don't understand what could have entered the intake to cause that...

Captain Bondo said:
That said, not having some form of overboost fuel cut is... unwise... just IMO.
Click to expand...

Gee, thanks Dad. :-P I'm glad you could make that valuable point, as if the whole experience of kabooming my favorite ride didn't drive it home already. :-(

Well, at any rate, there are a lot of folks out there doing it. Pretty much everyone with a chipped LH.

It would be possible to use LH's fuel cut, but because it's a MAF system it's a little more complicated than setting it to "cut at X psi"...

When I have a running car again, I will be able to do some datalogging and will find a reasonable value for the fuel cut. May be a while because I just blew what was going to be my Holset money on a used o-scope so I can continue with the LH/EZK development.
 
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Ping could possibly have broken the spark plug ceramic and bounced around in there for a bit. But that damage is definitely not directly caused by ping..
 
Poik said:
Ping could possibly have broken the spark plug ceramic and bounced around in there for a bit. But that damage is definitely not directly caused by ping..
Click to expand...

Yeah I was going to mention this exact thing. I guess he would have noticed a missing sparkplug end, but yeah that's totally what it looks like.
 
The VW dealer mumbled something vague, and gave the customer a free glowplug after they broke one off in her motor...Thanks guys.
IMG_3245.jpg

It's running fine now.
 
I wonder if you could use a hobbes switch and a 5v regulator to feed in the 5v cutout signal to the MAF line to simulate the MAF overrun cutoff... unless the chipping disables the 5v MAF overrun cutout.

Just a thought.

Oh and yea what did the spark plug look like?
 
I wonder if you could use a hobbes switch and a 5v regulator to feed in the 5v cutout signal to the MAF line to simulate the MAF overrun cutoff... unless the chipping disables the 5v MAF overrun cutout.

Just a thought.

Oh and yea what did the spark plug look like?

Or you could have a spark cut if you opened the signal to the ign. system, like the ign amplifier or possibly a coil lead.
 
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That seems a bit sever for a spark plug...My 242 broke and ate a sprk plug while I was home, and it just at it and barely did any damage, maybe b21fts are just manlier? :e-shrug:
 
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MrBill said:
NMCI blocks your ****ty dropbox :-(
Click to expand...

Pics are on FB as well.

Plugs looked absolutely unremarkable when I pulled them earlier this year (though they were Bosch). I guess the current working theories are:

- piston ring bits
- turbo bits

I'll examine the turbo more closely tonight, though I think it would have given a noticible indication of it's unhappiness? Either way, head is trashed.... right?

I have already sourced a nice, ported head from Brettzilla so a valve swap and I will be back on track.
 
don't think the turbo coughed up parts, I would think that whatever went through the engine probably went through the turbo too. are the pieces a brass color or is that just the camera you used? think maybe you broke part of a valve guide?

head could be cleaned up if you wanted to, but it's probably not worth the effort when you can cruise into the junkyard and get another one for like $40.
 
Piston ring bits have a hard time coming around that piston crown without leaving a very noticeable gouge or chunk, I don't see anything like that.

Are you missing a throttle valve screw?
 
Was something happy living in the intercooler; perhaps for a long time??

Throttle valve screw is certainly believable.

You do a big boost run that blasts it from it's home.... It finds it's way past the throttle plate and into the chamber to raise all kinds of hell......

Bummer OP..... Here is your opportunity to do it up real nice with fresh pistons..... H-Beam rods.... ect ect...
 
linuxman51 said:
are the pieces a brass color or is that just the camera you used? think maybe you broke part of a valve guide?
Click to expand...

Camera sucks, (phone) was playing with it trying to get the color right, oh well. It's all silver colored.

I'll be closely going over things tonight... Throttle, turbo, IC, etc. Hopefully I figure out what happened. This is making me paranoid about putting together my other motor.

I'm sure it'll be ok, but.... ugh.

But you all know what this means... how psi a stock can support? 30! :rofl:
 
Magnum TE said:
I wonder if you could use a hobbes switch and a 5v regulator to feed in the 5v cutout signal to the MAF line to simulate the MAF overrun cutoff... unless the chipping disables the 5v MAF overrun cutout.

Just a thought.

Oh and yea what did the spark plug look like?

Or you could have a spark cut if you opened the signal to the ign. system, like the ign amplifier or possibly a coil lead.
Click to expand...

Just put the hobbes switch in series with the fuel pump relay trigger. No need for regulators etc. Keep Engine safety functions as simple as possible. If it overboosts, shut the fuel pump off.
 
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